I’ve been waiting quite a while to get the opportunity to post this VERY exciting news coming out of Lion Brewery and there is a LOT to tell. Things are changing at Lion and changing in a way that will make our local craft beer lovers VERY happy.
First, beginning at 4PM tomorrow (3/4) an ALL NEW Stegmaier IPA will be brewed; and early next week an ALL NEW Stegmaier Pale Ale will be in the tanks. These are completely new recipes and not related to Pocono Pale Ale, in fact this signals the end of Pocono Pale Ale. This is incredibly exciting so stay tuned later this week for all of the details (IBU, hop & malt varieties and even some photos.) Also stay tuned here for periodic updates as the beer ferments.
Next Stegmaier Blueberry Wheat has been mini-brewed in the Sabco system using a Kolsch Recipe created by Greg Reid (one of Lion’s resident QA/lab tech/beer geeks.) It’s also my understanding this was neck & neck with a recipe developed by Ray Buchman (Brewing Supervisor) and the decision was made for pure logistics and both base wheat beers were fantastic.
Here’s the sentence MANY local beer lovers have been waiting for…Hops have been ordered for the brewing of Summer Stock Lager (YES it’s coming back!)
Experimentation is also underway on the Sabco system for a fall pumpkin beer and there’s even a long shot possibility for a Brewmasters Choice-type of series where once a year one of the Brewmasters brews a special beer.
So here’s the thing. Lion Brewery can’t do this alone. This is a major shift in the marketing and name of Stegmaier, and an incredible positive shift in brewing for our local craft beer lovers from our local brewery. The guys at Lion tell me they have taken it as a personal challenge to change the paradigm at Lion and “to have the Lion Brewery seen as the world-class brewery it is, brewing world-class beers that stand up to the scrutiny of world-class beer geeks.”
The bad news is I’m already hearing that some of our local distributors are hesitant to pick up the new line of beers from Stegmaier, so WE need to intervene. The first batch of these beer will be a VERY limited run. I can’t stress how incredibly important it is for us to ask our local distributors for Stegmaier IPA and Stegmaier Pale Ale. If you like it, you want it and you want Lion to keep brewing….Ask For It! We’ve been asking Lion to be experimental and we’ve been asking Lion to brew craft beers. Now it’s time for us to step up and request it. This is not hype or a sales pitch. Only our demand will drive these beers in the future.
Finally a well deserved cheers to Leo, Bob, Darel, Greg and Ray for creating some new and exciting beers, and to Cliff for standing behind them…Tune in tomorrow for more details.
what is the pricepoint going to be on these new beers? If it's similar to their seasonals then I think that's fantastic, and I'll definitely be looking for the IPA in particular. If it's going to creep up toward Sierra Nevada Torpedo, however, or even higher, then it's really going to depend on the quality. I'll look forward to trying these regardless.
ReplyDeleteThanks Josh. I'll let you know as I hear more. I can't wait to try them myself. I've heard some of the ingredients and they sound first class.
ReplyDeleteI can comment - pricepoint will be similar to our current seasonals. Due to our buying power and Bob's extensive list of contacts and umm...well-connected friends, we had plenty of budget to play with. I can say in all confidence we finished the IPA recipe, looked at pricing, and realized we actually had money left to spend on it, but we left it alone. It was at a point where spending more money, and taking more money out of your pocket, was not going to make it any better. I want to assert: there were NO CORNERS CUT in formulating these beers. Budget wasn't even considered until we had the beer we wanted to brew, and after we had that we were pleasantly surprised.
ReplyDeleteWas afraid of running out of comment room...
ReplyDeleteMBB alluded to the "paradigm" we are trying to change and that illustrates it perfectly - Bob, Leo and myself decided we no longer wanted to brew a good beer "for the price". We wanted to brew a great beer for any price. We don't want people trying the new Steg beers because they're cheap. We want them trying them because they heard that beer geeks were lining up around the block just to try to get their hands on some. We want our own Beer Advocate acronym. This was our objective, and while I have to reserve judgement until we actually have beer in bottle, I'm proud of the fact that we took it to heart during the formulation phase, where 90% of all good ideas go to die. I hope now we don't let you down.
This is all great news...thanks Darel.
ReplyDeleteDarel,
ReplyDeletePlease be careful. I have been a devoted fan of the LIon since the mid 80's when i started drinking. I want you guys to flourish. I think your niche has always been successful because you offered a great beer for the price. Now, more than ever, there are hundreds/thousands of craft beers out there, all making the best beer they possibly can regardless of price. You will lose your distinction being one of these thousands. I saw it with Stegmaier porter. When it was 15 bucks a case there were stacks of it and it moved, my friends bought it. Now at 28 bucks a case it's hard to find, stacks have been reduced to one or two cases or it's not being carried.
I know professionally you see it as a challenge to "brew the best beer possible" and to prove to geeks that you can do it, and have them line up but I wonder if it is the best business model at this point, to be one of many. There's a reason lion lasted through the tought times of the 60's-90's.
To me, the Lion has always made "craft beer." A world class porter (check the geeks rating you are so trying to impress on BA), a bock, a winter warmer, all very good and in the past an IPA, a GREAT caramel porter. Shoot you guys had 2 porters at one time! Geeks are often judgemental and prejudice, and not in a good way.
ReplyDeleteI would cater less to fickle geeks always looking for the "next thing" or picking their poison based on the smallest/newest/most obscure/difficult to obtain.
Also I would call out the locals like Mr. Mybeerbuzzz has done, to actually buy the beer. How many cases of lion beer have you bought this year so far? Is it "5 or more" like me? Do you pour lion kegs in your home draft unit?
I agree with this anonymous commentor. Especially with styles like IPAs and Pale Ales the market is absolutely flooded with good beers at decent prices. I've only lived in this area for about 4 years and never had a Lion product till I moved here, but what has differentiated Stegmaier brews for me, and has kept me buying them, is that they are an outstanding value. That's not to imply that they're not great beers - the Bock, for instance, is far better than any that cost much more - but a good quality IPA that sells for around $25 a case and $7 a sick pack will stand out far more in the market than a slightly better quality IPA selling for $32 or $9/6er.
ReplyDeleteCool, I will try IF I can get them down here in Harrisburg. I cant get the seasonals down here so I'm a bit concerned these wont make it, either.
ReplyDeleteBlueberry Wheat? Haven't we tried the fruit beer thing a bunch of times in the past? That one I wont bother with, but I wish you success.
You should go with a proven 3 time medal winner-- LIEBOTSCHANER CREAM ALE!!!
I'm not sure I'd agree Anon. I think the plan is to still offer a great beer at a great price AND appeal to a new market. Show me a better value for a great Porter like Steg for less than $28 a case and I'm in...and by the way where I shop there are still stacks of Steg Porter going out the door. I count Lion among "one of the few" and even more so with this venture. I also count them among one of the few as far as local breweries, which I think distinguishes them in an even bigger way.
ReplyDeleteThanks Prof...I wish I had a home kegging unit but I do buy Porter in cases.
ReplyDeleteDon't worry about the beer geeks. The highest ratings, buzz and "lining up around the block" are reserved for a few chosen breweries. 3 Floyds, Russian River, Bells, Dogfish and the like are the only ones allowed to get A+ ratings. Once a brewery has been pigeon-holed it will never be seen in a different light. Don't be surprised if your new beers, regardless how good they are, get a pat on the head and a B or B+ rating.
ReplyDeleteI don't think anyone is willing to surrender that easily Anon. Not that I'd argue BA ratings have much meaning, but I think ANY beer can be an amazing beer.
ReplyDeleteI agree Mr. Buzz. My point is the geeks are too influnced by the "hype" and by their pre-judgements of a brewery. Steg's new IPA could be an amazing beer (I have no doubt they can do it) but the geeks will still be dismissive. "Pretty good for the price" and a B rating. Put, say, a Ballast Point label on that same beer and it'd be world-class.
ReplyDeleteI hope I'm wrong. I'd love to see people drive 100s of miles to stand in line on N. Penn Ave.
Anon is exactly right. Resist the temptation of appealing to the geeks, their mind is made up already, they will soon grow tired of intellectualizing their beer drinking. Appeal to your core fan base, those of us who were there before the geeks and will be there long after.
ReplyDeletePlease, how do we get ANY Stegmaier in SEPA? I have written to Lion and to Wegmans, but all I see is Lionshead. There may be a distributor somewhere, but they are few. Reading about Steg in Ohio, midwest states, etc. is frustrating when it's not readily available in PA (Chester County).
ReplyDeleteThe news is great. How can I get some?
So why can't a beer appeal to both a local loyal crowd and to a new craft beer crowd? I for one think it can and I'm sure the guys at Lion are thinking the same.
ReplyDeleteAs far as how to get some...who is your local distributor or where in SEPA are you? I think some of this is going to be up to as to be asking at the distributors.
It can, MrMBB, and I hope it does. I think the anons are just concerned about trying to woo an audience that cannot, or will not, be wooed. Just as the miller lite or ultra drinker drinks it to be seen with the label, and associated with the beautiful people on the commercials, anon pointed out that many of these geeks are similarly judgemental to the point of reserving big marks and hype for certain breweries.
ReplyDeleteJust hope the lion focuses more on their appreciative core audience and less on getting props on a website full of opinionated blow-hards (not this one, obviously).
I have no problem with anyone, in our out of PA, enjoying it. The frustration is that I can't. I am glad to read of non-PA BAs finding it to be a very good beer at a very good price.
ReplyDeleteI am in Chester Co. - perhaps I'll ping my distributor again.
I'd agree that you'll never make some people happy, and as much as these people clearly must need a beer I doubt anyone is losing any sleep over winning them over.
ReplyDeleteI'll see what I can find out about Chester Co, but YES it is up to us to hit the distributors and ask for it. Tell your friends too.
I'm discouraged too that in Harrisburg you can't get any seasonals. Thankfully I can get steg porter though :)
ReplyDeleteAlso I'd like to see more of a draft presence throughout PA. Not sure why the Lion continues to have almost zero draft presence outside of W-B and not much within W-B.
I've also found that few distributors want to do any work for you, they almost seem annoyed if you want somethign other than bud light or coors.
This is a great forum to let everyone know where we can and can't get Lion products. I know the guys will be tuning in. Hopefully between us asking our distributors and Lion pushing form their end we can affect a change.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad to hear of the positive craft-freindly attitude adopted at our brewery in W-B, but my sources tell me that not only is Pocono Pale Ale being relegated to the dustbin...get this...SO IS STEG PORTER!!!! Amber is also on the list, but that's not so unexpected. We're giving this up for a blueberry ale?
ReplyDeleteI'm hoping the Lion staff that participates here can confirm :-( or deny :-D this information. I'm also hoping MBB isn't being selectively fed only the positive.
Time will tell Sam.
ReplyDeleteAs long as the Lion continues to make a quality product and it is not over priced like some micros today, it will prove to be popular. Oftentimes, a higher price does not equal a better product. Their Holiday Warmer and October Fest, though, are two of the best seasonals on the market today. I also think it is important to offer an IPA because it is one of the more popular styles on the market. A key to success will be availability at both distributors and bars (in bottles and draft). Good Luck!
ReplyDeleteGuys, please just let me make a few things clear. While we ARE targeting our core audience, namely you loyal local Lion lovers, does that mean we have to "dumb down" our beer to appeal to the local audience? I've had many beers with a lot of you guys - you're all beer geeks in my mind. You all appreciate great beer and include it, and your local brewery, as part of your lives. Why, then, should you have to settle for "lesser" beer? Why can't the Lion brew truly world-class beer for you? I promise you we can and we will, and you're seeing the first steps in that direction.
ReplyDeleteOh, yeah, I just bought a sixer of SN Torpedo - while I can't really comment on price (I'm just a brewer after all), I can say that for what I paid for this particular bit of "industrial espionage" you'll get a far better value from the Lion.
Finally, if you can't find our seasonals or our craft lines in your local distributor, REQUEST THEM! I'm not afraid to admit the Lion does not have a great reputation - we are busting our asses to change that but until we do, distributors won't know you want our beer until you fill out a request form for it. They'll continue to turn us away and keep these beers out of your fridge until consumers prove to them it's worth it to carry Steg. Please do so!
Sam,
ReplyDeleteGood news on all fronts - Steg Porter is going nowhere. It MAY become a seasonal brew, but it will remain in the lineup. In fact, as mentioned above, there is a chance we'll return to being a "two-porter" brewery...but I'll leave that at that.
Also, Amber Lager will be returning to the original Steg 150 recipe! Not only is it not going away, it's getting better!
Excellent news Darel....now ask Bob to humor me and brew another batch of Carmel Porter ;)
ReplyDeleteThank you, Darel! I really appreciate your candor, and as long as the best porter in the lower 48 is made at least seasonally, that will be good enough for me. It cellars well!
ReplyDeleteTwo porters? God bless you, brother!
I was under the initial assumption that Steg Amber was to be the same as 150, but it was evident from the first sip that compromises had been made. The original recipe is a far superior product that I bought many cases of (great artwork, too)...the amber, only one.
This is all stellar information, and reinforces what you mentioned in your first comment about commitment. Looking forward to my first Summer Stock...I had no local distributor when it made its debut. Thanks again!
I'm not sure that I understand all the posted hatred toward the "beer geeks." Perhaps the posters grew up giving "geeks" swirlies and knocking their books down in the hallway. Come on Meatheads, it's time to face the music. You're reading AND posting on a dedicated beer blog. You ARE a geek; a beer geek. Either embrace it, or go give yourself a swirlie and wallow in self-hatred.
ReplyDeleteThanks Sam...this IS good news.
ReplyDeleteBony...I think it's a term of endearment "beer geek"
Confound you Sam K, spreading such vitriolic rumors about my historic and classic elixir, Stegmaier porter!
ReplyDeleteKudos to you, Mr. Matthews, for continuing the long-standing tradition of porter excellence from my brewery, if only I were able to enjoy a sip, although my Stegmaier's porter is definitely deservant of more than a seasonal limitation, I will continue to promote your product as best I can for I am, now and forever--
Thank you Mr. Stegmaier...an honor to meet you finally.... ;)
ReplyDeleteI was going to make the same comment someone else did about the use of the term 'beer geek.' There's no reason for it to be used to derisively by some; I'd call myself a beer geek but I'll try just about anything once. I don't understand this 'turning your nose up' sort of generalization being made by some...but I digress.
ReplyDeleteReading through these comments I'm thrilled to see that the recipe for Steg 150 is coming back. That was an excellent beer and far superior to the Amber. This is one beer geek who is very excited to see the new stuff rolling out.
Thanks Josh.
ReplyDeleteHaha, now we are getting politcally correct and sensitive about the term beer geek! Just like every other classification of people, there are good geeks and not so good geeks.
ReplyDeleteThanks for your work as an outlet for all this info, Mr. MBB! Keep it coming, and thanks to the lion for the steg porter, glad to read it's not going anywhere (although I haven't seen a new batch in too long)...
Darel-- Regarding the "other" porter-- this is the best news i've heard in a while. If not the return of the caramel porter I am SERIOUSLY HOPING for a return of the late 80's version-- the pennsylvania porter with the licorice accent. there is NO one brewing that kind of beer now, which is a rarity, and i know although not everyone dug it, there are quite a few of us old timers around here that totally did dig it. How about a seasonal release of it in a "retro series." You can even couple it with the lieb cream ale. Again, I dont know anyone doing a retro series amoung the THOUSANDS of beers out there-- you could be the first (difficult to do nowadays).
ReplyDeleteThanks Anon...yes I think we all need to have a beer.
ReplyDeleteGood idea Lee....Stegmaier Retro Series.
Pocono mountain water makes the difference
ReplyDeleteExcellent concept, Lee! Kudos!
ReplyDeletei live in ct and i'm a devout steg drinker, this is fantastic news.i would love to see the Lion get the respect it deserves and i'll happily spread the word and share some of the new beers with folks....and Summer Stock Lager?? for THIS summer? too good to be true!
ReplyDeleteI agree and it sounds like we'll see it...
ReplyDeletehi all
ReplyDeletei am not a beer consumer as of the last 10 years or so but my last bestest beer (ale) was liebotschaner cream ale. has anyone heard if the lion brewery is going to start production on this beer again?
if anyone has any input could you please let me know
thank you
bob donchez
wb3hyb@rcn.com
610-833-2966
Hi Anon...there has been much talk of Lion bringing back Lieb and I suspect it will happen. Stay tuned to mybeerbuzz.com for the latest details.
ReplyDeleteI would gladly buy Steg IPA if #1 i could find it, (im in Pike county pa and work in Sussex county Nj so Lion is LOCAL.) but I cant even find steg porter...
ReplyDeleteIf they could do an IPA that could match the caliber of the likes of Stone,boulders mojo,smuttynose,greenflash,Victory hop whallop, etc.. and got it FRESH snce im local i would glady buy.,
I used to buy Steg Porter because it was an excellent beer at a low price ( $14.99 to start with). But then it kept going up, up, up, and I quit buying it around $16.99. I can't believe it is now $28 a case. Are you guys making like 200 percent profit ???? Whatever the market will bear ???
ReplyDeleteAnds why is all beer 30 percent more expensive than just 2 years ago ???
Oh by the way, the distributor I used to get Sreg Porter in doesn't even carry it any more.
Hi Anon...not sure where you're shopping but I haven't even seen Steg Porter break $19 in our area let alone even coming close to $28. I believe the last I checked it was $15. While I'd still say at $28 it's a great value...to each his/her own on price. I think you'd actually be amazed at how little profit there is in most beer.
ReplyDeleteI'm not sure if you followed along a few years back, but hop contracts and a hop shortage pretty much drove all the prices up and they haven't come back down...nor will they.
Just my .02